From: kingman@austin.ibm.com (John Kingman) Subject: Item #356: Administrivia: OFWG Minutes for April/May Meeting Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 18:02:10 -0500 (CDT) P1275 Open Firmware Working Group Proposal -- Proposal #356 Ver Title: Minutes of Open Firmware Working Group meeting on April 30, and May 1, 1996 Author: John Kingman Date: May 2, 1996 Attached please find the minutes of our last meeting held April 30, and May 1, 1996 at IBM, Austin, TX. Thanks to Bob Coffin for making the arrangements. Also please note that: (1) our next meeting will be at Firmworks in Mountain View, CA, on June 25-26, 1996 and (2) check the "Action Item Summary" at the end of this note for your action items. The minutes of the subcommittee are also attached, following the minutes of the main OFWG meeting. Regards, John Kingman, Secretary Open Firmware Working Group kingman@austin.ibm.com ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 1- Attendees Mitch Bradley FirmWorks/President 415-961-1302 wmb@firmworks.com Chairman Open Firmware Working Group (5/1/1996 only) David M. Kahn Sun Microsystems 415-336-2784 dmk@Eng.Sun.Com Vice Chairman Open Firmware Working Group John Kingman IBM Risc System/6000 512-838-1546 kingman@austin.ibm.com Secretary Open Firmware Working Group Ron Hochsprung Apple/Sys. Arch. 408-974-2661 ron@apple.com Bob Coffin IBM Risc System/6000 512-838-8240 coffin@vnet.ibm.com John Dickol IBM Microelectronics 512-838-6005 dickol@vnet.ibm.com Greg Hill Firmworks 415-917-6985 GREGH@FIRMWORKS.COM Jordan Brown Sunsoft 310-348-6039 jordan.brown@west.sun.com John Hall Sun Microsystems 415-786-6927 John.Hall@eng.sun.com David Paktor Sun Microelectronics 408-774-8306 PAKTOR@ENG.SUN.COM Tom Kriz IBM Risc System/6000 512-838-6542 Mike Segapeli IBM Risc System/6000 512-838-8428 mikes@austin.ibm.com John O'Quin IBM Risc System/6000 512-838-3904 oquin@austin.ibm.com 2- Review Agenda Proposed agenda (#339) was reviewed and approved unanimously, 9-0-0, with the provision that David Kahn could rearrange items to improve work flow. #339: Closed, agenda approved. 3- Administrative/Procedural items - Discussion of use of ftp sites to expedite proposal processing. David Kahn reiterated his request for at least one week lead time on proposals. Drafts which have not been reviewed by the OFWG should be marked "Unapproved Draft #.#" Jordan Brown may suggest wording for various document stages. - We publicly thank Apple and David "Lefty" Schlesinger for setting up the mirror site. - Submit documents to David Kahn in pdf, postscript, and text formats, preferably via an ftp site he can access. 4- Last meeting minutes review Approved the minutes of the meeting of March 5, 1996 (#329) by voice vote. #329: Closed, minutes approved. 5- Future Meetings June 25 - 26, 1996: Firmworks, Mountain View, CA Host: Mitch Bradley Directions to Firmworks available on http://www.firmworks.com August 13 - 14, 1996: Apple Computer, Cupertino, CA Host: Ron Hochsprung October 8 - 9, 1996: ? Austin or Tempe Host: ? (Bob Coffin to resolve) 6- Standard Progress Report --- Closed --- 1275-1994: OF Core (Official IEEE Standard) 1275.1-1994: SPARC ISA (Official IEEE Standard) 1275.2-1994: SBus Bus Binding (Official IEEE Standard) p1275.4/d14 FB+ (Passed sponsor ballot, in editing, editor: Paula Kelty) New status on 4/18: The document is apparently done, waiting for status update and copies from Mary Lynn, via Martin. p1275.5 68K (PAR Withdrawn by the working group) --- Open ----- p1275.3: VME (Sponsor ballot failed due to lack of response) David Paktor is trying to revise the PAR to limit the scope to VME-32, and exclude the VME-64 issues. Current State: Awaiting NESCOM review and approval. Owner: David Paktor p1275.6/d5: 64 Bit Extensions (Negative Ballots w.r.t. 32 bit compatibility) Owner: David Kahn p1275.a Errata to 1275-1994 (Core Errata), Sponsor Ballot, Balloting body has been formed, awaiting approval of balloting body via Martin. Owner: David Kahn 7- Action Items Review -1- Closed - The TI license only covers NuBus. FCode for self-test on a plug-in card might be affected. -2- Open -add a request for at least one week lead time and that drafts which have not been reviewed by the OFWG should be marked "Unapproved Draft #.#" (Jordan may suggest wording for various document stages.) -4- Open - Greg Hill volunteered to take it over, John Hall will help. -5- Closed - document to be produced. -6- Open refer to 11.1.4 -7- Open -9- Closed (Moot) -11- Open -12- Open -14- Closed - see #350 -15- Closed - see latest PCI binding -17- Open -18- Closed -- subcommittee should refer items back to main group as appropriate -19- Closed -- subcommittee secretary should update and inform David -20- Closed -- update is in 1.7 -21- Closed -- new proposals -22- Closed -- update is in 1.7 -23- Closed -24- Open The following AIs are still open: <2,4,6,7,9,11,12,17,23,24> 8- Other Pending/Tabled items #250 - Open, Tabled: activate when needed. #310 - Closed, accepted with amendment 8-0-0 #322 - Open, line-ending definition and wording needs work #323a - Closed - PCI 1.7 #323b - Open, Create recommended practice for output devices (e.g. VGA) #321 - Closed, superceded by #355 #320 - Closed, withdrawn by author #324 - Closed - see #336 9- New Proposal Status Summary: #326 -- Closed, accepted with amendment 9-0-1 #327 -- Closed, accepted with amendment 8-0-0 #328 -- Closed, withdrawn by author, superceded by #333 #329 -- Closed, minutes approved. #330 -- Closed, remanded to subcommittee #331 -- Closed, withdrawn by author #332 -- Closed, remanded to subcommittee #333 -- Closed, withdrawn by author, superceded by #352 #336 -- Open #337 -- Closed, accepted as amended: 9-0-0 #338 -- Closed, accepted as amended: 10-0-1 #339 -- Closed, agenda approved. #340 -- Closed, withdrawn by author, see #327 #341 -- Closed, withdrawn by author, see #342 #342 -- Tabled #343 -- Closed, accepted 8-0-0 #344 -- Not Addressed #345 -- Not Addressed #346 -- Not Addressed #347 -- Not Addressed #348 -- Not Addressed #349 -- Tabled #350 -- Not Addressed #351 -- Open #352 -- Tabled #353 -- Closed, accepted with amendment 11-0-0 #354 -- Closed, remanded to subcommittee #355 -- Closed, rejected 11-0-0 10- Document Reviews (including associated proposals, if any) PCI Binding Review Revision 1.7 Unapproved Draft -- rev. hist to include #323a -- page iv, line 43: correct clock-frequency spelling -- page 16, line 5: Insert section level 4.2.1 for the methods, following 4.2 -- page 17, line 41: add words about setting cache line size -- misc: use italics or something to offset lower case Ls Related Proposals: #310: closed, accepted with amendment 8-0-0 amendment: Leave it up to the implementation (and describe in a footnote) referring to section 3.5 in 2.1 PCI Spec, as to the trade-offs in programming the primary latency timer. (See also section 5.5.18 in the PCI Bridge Spec 1.0) #326: closed, replace with friendly amendment 9-0-1 amendment: p17 l38, replace sentence beginning with "For each base ..." with the following: "For each child node, create an "assigned-addresses" property with entries for each address base register (or register pair) for which an address was assigned." #327: closed, accepted with amendment 8-0-0 amendment: Leave it up to the implementation (and describe in a footnote) referring to section 3.5 in 2.1 PCI Spec, as to the trade-offs in programming the primary latency timer. #340: Closed, withdrawn by author, see #327 #349: Tabled (New AI 25) #353: Closed, accepted with amendment 11-0-0 amendment: page 19, line 9: delete page 19, line 10: change "38" to "1A" SCSI-3 Binding Review Draft Version 1 #352: Tabled -- 1) is SBP the same as 1394? (John Hall) -- 2) how does this fit in with the device tree? i.e. what if the device is 1394 and I have scsi-3 and non-scsi-3 devices out on that bus? What's the topology? The discussion pretty much centered around the fact that since scsi-3 is just a software protocol using essentially a 'network' device as the hardware transport there probably is no need for a scsi-3 device-type ... the code could be embedded in the underlying bus device driver, using the read and write methods of the parent (which have semantics similar to network devices) to transmit packets. If it makes sense to "packagize" some of the common 'scsi3' support functions to the extent that there would be a net savings of code space, then perhaps, there Generic Names Recommended Practice review Version 1.1 Unapproved Draft #336: Open -- Table 1 to removed once it is in the PCI binding, Change Section 6 to Example (Informative) -- Change 'processor' to 'cpu'. -- Rename to <"Device Names"> Related Proposals: #331: Closed, withdrawn by author What does "compatible" mean? Recommended Practice Draft Version 0.1 #343: Closed, accepted 8-0-0 -- Last sentence of 3.1 and the term "[ their ] defined semantics" needs clarification. Section 5 needs to be rewritten. This should be folded into a rewritten and renamed generic names proposal. -- Jordan and Bob are directed to create a new combined and rewritten <"Device Names"> unapproved draft RP Interrupt Mapping Recommended Practice review Unapproved Draft 0.6 #355: Closed, rejected in favor of new proposal. 11-0-0 -- discussion of need for proposal to change PCI "interrupts" or a masking proposal -- Ron Hochsprung to rework and resubmit OBP-TFTP Recommended Practice review Draft Version 0.5 #351: Open -- page 4, line 4: "EtherNet" should be "MAC" -- page 4, line 51: "client" should be "server" -- page 6, line 5: allow literal string "bootp" ahead of the first argument. Also allow giaddr, bootp-retries, and tftp-retries to be optional. -- check if subnet-mask is required -- fix use of "%NONE%" -- look into IPMG impact -- Suggested Changes: Get rid of the methods. Get rid of the new semantics of open. obp-tftp open shouldn't do anything 'extra'. Perhaps obp-tftp open gets called at 'load' time. Implement the ping ui as an external word that understands the ip protocol. Change arguments to open: "promiscuous,..." - Eaten by network device "bootp,..." - Play bootp, allow some args to be specified. ... - No bootp, use arguments specified on the command line. Delete the methods and publish the initial bootreply packet as encoded-bytes in /chosen. (obp-tftp). Device Support Extensions Recommended Practice Related Proposals: #337: Closed, accepted as amended 9-0-0 amendment: Change to say "x-values increase when moving to the 'right' and 'y' values increase when moving 'down'." #338: Closed, accepted as amended: 10-0-1 amendment: remove material relating to scancodes and language #341: Closed, withdrawn by author, see #342 #342: Tabled amendment: Change "It is expected and recommended ... " to "New Platform bindings are encouraged to require compliance with this recommended practice." 11- Action Items Summary Old AIs still open: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | No.|Who |Description | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 2 |Editors of |Update document template and contents per discussion. | | |Recommended |Drafts should be marked "Unapproved Draft #.#", unless| | |Practice |otherwise directed by the OFWG. Please allow at least| | |documents |one week lead time prior to OFWG meeting for review. | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 4 |Greg H. |Standard properties document. | | |John H. | | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 6 |Ron H. |Work on "reg," "assigned-addresses," base address | | |Jordan B. |registers in the PCI binding. | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 7 |Jordan B. |Work on names, unit-address... in ISA binding | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 11 |Jordan B. |Reorganize discussion of probing in ISA binding | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 12 |Jordan B. |Suggest wording for IRQ 2 vs 9 | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 17 |Ron H. |Prepare proposal for Code Page selection. | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 24 |Ron H. |talk to Mitch Bradley to clarify line-end for #322 | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- New AIs: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | No.|Who |Description | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | 25 |Ron H. |Work out use of probe-pci with Paul Thomas (#349) | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Subcommittee Minutes for May 1, 1996: - Last meeting minutes review (Proposal #332) Voted 9-0-0 to approve the minutes of the subcommittee meeting of March 6, 1996. #332 -- Closed, minutes approved. - PowerPC Processor binding Revision 1.10 DRAFT Related Proposals: #330: Tabled, -- John Kingman to get with Bill Rees and clarify need and what is most common among PPC platforms - PReP Binding Related Proposals: #354: Closed, Accepted 9-0-0 -- Jordan to make updates and publish revised binding - Action Items: -S1- Closed -S2- Open -S3- Closed -S4- Open -S5- Open -S6- Closed -S7- Closed -S8- Open - Action Items Summary Old AIs still open: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | No.|Who |Description | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | S2 |Ron H. | Update and create v1.1 Forth and FCode Rec Practice | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | S4 |Bob C. | Make "shared-bus-master" proposal | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | S5 |Ron H. | Make "chording" (keyboard) proposal | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | S8 |Mitch B. | Propose that debug facilities not be supported | | | | in real-mode. | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- New AIs: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | No.|Who |Description | |----|------------|------------------------------------------------------| | S9 |John K. |Get with Bill Rees and clarify #330 | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ [ P1275 Item #356 -- Received: Thu May 2 16:01:23 PDT 1996 ]